Post Meeting Discussions
 

This is the space designated to discuss points that were made during the meeting that you feel that were inconclusive or that may need more time to discuss.

Post Meeting Disscusion
 

Concerning 3rd Party Programs and POTCO.

It was motioned before the Court on Wednesday (8/5/09) that 3rd party voice chat programs be allowed for SVS tournaments.

To clarify, TBC does not endorse nor condone the use of 3rd party voice chat programs during our events. This includes glitch & cheat programs and chat & voice programs.

And although other programs that do not effect the game play ( i.e. voice chat programs ) are not prohibited by the Mouse, there are many kids who do play the game and therefore suggest that IF YOU CHOOSE TO USE A VOIP or CHAT Program for game play, to DO SO AT YOUR OWN DISCRETION and RISK.

But don't just take my word on the subject, let's hear what the mouse has to say.

Take it away Mickey! :mickeypiratezd4:

No Cheating - Any use of third party programs is not allowed. Players who use any third party programs while playing risk being permanently banned.

this is further difined as:

1. (a) is defamatory, abusive, harassing, threatening, or an invasion of a right of privacy of another person; (b) is bigoted, hateful, or racially or otherwise offensive; (c) is violent, vulgar, obscene, pornographic or otherwise sexually explicit; or (d) otherwise harms or can reasonably be expected to harm any person or entity;

2. is illegal or encourages or advocates illegal activity or the discussion of illegal activities with the intent to commit them, including a Submission that is, or represents an attempt to engage in, child pornography, stalking, sexual assault, fraud, trafficking in obscene or stolen material, drug dealing and/or drug abuse, harassment, theft, or conspiracy to commit any criminal activity;

3. infringes or violates any right of a third party including: (a) copyright, patent, trademark, trade secret or other proprietary or contractual rights; (b) right of privacy (specifically, you must not distribute another person's personal information of any kind without their express permission) or publicity; or (c) any confidentiality obligation;

4. is commercial, business-related or advertises or offers to sell any products, services or otherwise (whether or not for profit), or solicits others (including solicitations for contributions or donations);

5. contains a virus or other harmful component, or otherwise tampers with, impairs or damages the WDIG Sites or any connected network, or otherwise interferes with any person or entity's use or enjoyment of the WDIG Sites; or

6. (a) does not generally pertain to the designated topic or theme of the relevant Public Forum; (b) violates any specific restrictions applicable to a Public Forum, including its age restrictions and procedures; or (c) is antisocial, disruptive, or destructive, including "flaming," "spamming," "flooding," "trolling," and "griefing" as those terms are commonly understood and used on the Internet.

This is for game and widgets

:SkullBullet1:

Well put Roxy! and you too Mickey. May I also add some things are best left to the forums for disscussion...

Thank you !
 

Just to clarify...

Voice applications like X-Fire only fall under this if a PvP or SvS crew are using voice chat to their advantage AND SOMEHOW found out. Pirates in PvP and SvS can already use the Crew Chat option, voice is just faster responding.

Understand - I AM NOT CONDONING UNETHICAL BEHAVIOR, especially in Pirate vs. Pirate events - I ABHOR GLITCHING!! HATE HATE HATE IT! But, voice apps have other uses to. They can help crew leader organize without fear of typos or italics. They allow guild and officer meetings to occur REAL TIME while players are playing the game...

A few of comments from the last couple of meetings. I've noticed that we are still having issues of non-member guilds attending and taking floor time away from member guilds, also attendence of more than two members per guild taking time away and disrupting the meeting. I know everyone in my guild has been instructed not to tp to me during our meeting or they will be removed from the guild,that's how serious we take this court. We all know that these rules have been enacted to streamline and make our meetings run smooth and fast so we can handle the business at hand and get to our planned event for the evening. These rules of the code need to be enforced somehow and once the meeting has adjourned the floor needs to be closed and all tp away to the event.:mickeypiratezd4: P.S. Rox you are doing a awesome job and have the patience of a saint :)

I missed most of last meeting trying to enforce that issue Eva. We are trying hard to make sure it goes smooth for everyone.

Now on the voice chat issue... It is on my view that those can and should be allowed, however... Since it has become an issue claiming unfair advantage to those that don't use them, I think next time we have an event that involves PvP/SvS lets put a warning on the event. But my views and opinions are not the one of The Court. We abide by POF and POTCO ruling.

Just to comment on the members in attendance thing. In the ETC's defense at this past meeting, I was unable to attend on time due to a prior commitment - upon returning home I found the meeting still in progress and joined my two officers (who kindly went in my stead) to get caught up.

Despite NUMEROUS postings, two of my membership did TP to me. Both were courteous enough to leave once I told them to. I do post on our own guild's site when meetings are. However, as members sign onto the game - no matter of warnings can catch everyone. But, I will continue to mention it.

I read your post, Roxy, but I don't think the third party program issue is limited to what you "further difined(sic)."

It looks more like a chop job to meet your particular desire for what Disney meant by third party programs. The actual rules state:

"No Cheating - Any use of third party programs is not allowed. Players who use any third party programs while playing risk being permanently banned."

Now, I uderstand that Disney's intent is to limit outside programs so people can avoid the language filters and then gain email addresses and other personal information. Realize that by bypassing Disney's language controls you are automatically violating their terms of service.

NOWHERE does Disney authorize the use of third party VOIP as an acceptable bypass to their chat rules.

Be very careful, mates. If you chose to do so you are violating POTCO TOS and could face a ban. Disney is merely trying to protect the children that play their games.

Now to add to the debate here is more from the OFFICIAL Mouse aka Disney --- (Pay close attention to #1 & #5)

Disney's Online Netiquette
Whether this is your first time online or you're a seasoned visitor, we've spelled out a few of our House Rules for you here. To more fully understand your obligations while a visitor to our sites, please read our Terms of Use in their entirety. Generally speaking, these House Rules simply require respect and good manners. Use common sense and you'll feel right at home.

House Rules

1. We live by words online, so when it comes to message boards, e-mails, or chats of any kind, we don't allow obscene, bigoted, or sexually explicit language. We reserve the right to remove postings that contain obscene, bigoted, insulting, abusive, or hateful content, and suspend or terminate the guest accounts of anyone who posts such content. Any harassing notes or postings that might be construed as stalking will be deleted, and we reserve the right to inform and/or provide assistance to law enforcement agencies in any way we deem appropriate. We also reserve the right to remove notes that are off the subject or not in English.

2. No solicitations or advertisements are allowed. These include advertisements for any business or latest get-rich-quick scheme. Such notes add clutter and devalue conversation.

3. You may not suggest, encourage, boast about, or discuss your participation in, any illegal activity. If illegal activity is discussed on message boards or in chat rooms, we reserve the right to inform and/or provide assistance to law enforcement agencies in any way we deem appropriate.

4. You must have copyright ownership of all material that you post on our message boards and in our chats. No articles, recipes, song lyrics, art, graphics, or other material may be posted without the express written consent of the copyright holder.

5. You should never give out any personal information about yourself or anyone else, and never ask for personal information from others. This means no posting of phone numbers, screen or user names (including Voice Over Internet Programs (VOIPs)), addresses, e-mail addresses, Social Security numbers, passwords, or any other private information. In addition, any discussion of Web addresses or social networking Web sites where personal information is, or can be posted or exchanged, is not allowed.

6. Having good manners online means that you don't post the same note more than once. The online word for posting many times on one topic is "spamming." We don't allow that.

7. You participate at your own risk on the message boards, in chat, and in e-mail. All chats may be monitored by our staff members. You take responsibility for postings under your identification and use the information provided on this site, including on message boards, chat, and e-mail, at your own risk. We take no responsibility for the content or opinions posted on message boards, chat, and e-mail.

8. We reserve the right to remove any postings (although we have no duty to do so).

9. If you see any chat, or message board post that you feel violates any of the above house rules, please notify the community host by e-mail.

10. By posting to any portion of this site, you agree to abide by our Terms of Use.

11. Use good judgment, and have a wonderful time.

© Disney. All rights reserved.

I can appreciate your commentary and participation in this forum Dhestroyer, but might I suggest that you mates kindly fill out an application to belong to this court and await approval of such before further attendance and participation in this court.

Those are some fine rules Disney has placed in their TOS and are designed to protect our children and others who play this game. However if #5 is read correctly , it only prohibits the mention or "posting" of voip's or third party programs addresses and info, not the use of them.

Allow me to Clarify TBC stance once more.

We do not endorse, or condone the use of any 3rd party programs that would put players in violation of their terms of service agreement with Disney, POTCO & POF.

You as a player that choses to use such a program does so at your own risk.

Excuse me, but I hope that the above was not addressed to me in reference to filling out an application to belong to this court and awaiting approval. BBK has a representative--MY REPRESENTATIVE--that is a member of the court.

How about THIS as a suggestion: contact Disney DIRECTLY and ASK if VOIP during game-play is authorized. That should take any guesswork out of it.

As for any other membership issues, I would be thankful for ANY input that could prevent any members of POTCO from violating terms of service.

Ty Bart , I did just that and contacted a Disney representative, she checked with her supervisor and it is as I stated , they have no policy against the use of voip, their concerns, as their TOS states, is that no information is posted in game such as web sites or voip names addy's etc.
NO ONE to their knowledge has been banned from the game for using voip, but have been for mentioning it in game chat.

This is an open forum to all members of POF, one does not have to be a member of TBC to post comments here. What you choose to do with the court in game is totally up to you, but you may not ask POF members not to voice opinions or comments in any POF forum in which they have site permission to post in.

carry on...

Hello Bart, no it wasnt direct to you, I dont believe we have met, hope to meet you soon at a TBC meeting/event. Have a great day :zix0sn:

hypocrites
 

My mistake mate, I guess we will have to keep it in game:piratewhip:

thank you Sarah
I am a member of this forum
and as such I do not want other members mislead into doing something that can cause them to be banned permanently from the game

TY Dhestroyer, for this post, a lot do take risks with rules and lead others to do so unaware of the possible consequences, it is not for us to 'presume' the specifics on the disney rules.

What we do know from sorry experience is that some have lost their accounts for use of other programmes uttering reference to places where to access them in the game.
It is my understanding that leading anyone from pirates to a site where outside contact can be made has been for more than one person who has played pirates a reason for reprimand, both in warning and in termination.
It makes sense therefore that we should adhere to the rules Disney set out, we know why they are in place, most would agree that in a game where a lot of younger players interact with adults that these measures are there for good reason.

If you do not agree with the disney rules or the straightforward interpretation of them, then take it up with disney instead of arguing that your view must be correct.

Maya

not putting anyone down here, nor am I trying to start any trouble.
but your "rep" asked his supervisor?
is this supervisor in charge of Disney policy? Not sure ... I wouldn't bet my membership on it ... as for sailing as a team my guild uses the chat supplied by Disney and my guild sails as a team. Of course as mentioned above how would Disney know .... can it be stopped... no idea but this game is Disney's and we should be playing by their rules as we agreed to in the terms of use not how we intrepid said rules. The rules are there to protect not just children but your privacy. And unlike what is stated in the POTC movie ... these rules are not just guidelines.

Team Speak
 

My point wasnt made clear enough I guess so I will try again. Any program that is used in pirates to gain an advantage of your opponant in any way is a violation of the rules. If you want to use it fine, I ask that in THE TEAM SVS contest it not be used because we for one cant crew chat and another reason we have to type to communicate....which causes you to look away from the screen and controls of the ship. If in a battle with ships that use TS I believe I am clearly at a disadvantage for obvious reasons. Do I think my opinion matters nope. But just wanted to be heard. No hate hear, just what I think. Davy Burnrat

Here's a thought... Why not make crews with different members of different guilds? That way we all have to type to communicate with your crew members and teams. It could also help as a way to learn how to trust those sailing with you.

That would not be a bad idea Skirata if we got on better than we do.
But to be fair we all excel with our own crews, each one gelling and sailing with its own techniques and skill set. Events are not about splitting crew unity, nor about creating elite pirates via the use of streamline communications over people who effectively have non, its a fun event that shouldn't cause this much grief.
I guess this is giving those who dont svs as regular as the svs guilds a sense of the divide we have here and if we cannot agree on a common mode of communication - and I strongly suggest that it IS the method as provided to us IN GAME by Disney then the events put on WILL NOT be fair and WILL NOT be supported by all, causing fractions in the BRETHREN.

When Davy Burnrat put his question to the court on wednesday night it was a valid question and remains unresolved.

In this case I too, coming from the perspective of the 'under dog' sought the reassurance from the court with regard to an issue which is right there in the protocol and rules of Disney as a big 'no no' so why this is even considered ok in ANY event is beyond me.
BUT
As a court we have to decide on whether its fair for those of us who are not prepared to break with Disney rules and protocol (whether that be for security reasons or for moral reasons) to be OBLIGED to, in order to keep up in these events add a talk programme, which as Roxanna has pointed out is entered into at our own risks.


Even in Eva jewel's post she points out that you CAN BE BANNED but has chosen to disregard the information as she is reassured by operator and superviser that no one has been banned for doing it, this is flouting the good nature of Disney with regard to a rule which was confirmed. I am not going to flout any such rule.


The SVS Team event in NO WAY reflected how we sail normally in svs. In real pirate times a captain was NOT isolated from communicating with his crew: nor in the DISNEY game Pirates Of The Caribbean are we expected to not have crew talk. But the very fact that we were on tuesday night throws light on an issue that DOES need to be addressed.
Or it will jeopardise the integrity of the unity in the Brethren Court.

That is not to say that this issue cannot be overcome, I know it can but I can assure you there will be others, question is will the non svs guilds be as dedicated to talking through these issues before they get bored and stop attending the court sessions, I for one would hate to see that happen but with constant unrest like this - and I really do feel we walked STRAIGHT into this one I wouldnt blame anyone for saying this is getting to be too regular a theme in the court and bowing out.
All bickering aside, I think we can be sure to look upon one thing as a positive from this, this fact is out in the open now and we can as a the Brethren Court and as SVSers see what we are facing day to day and address common concerns.

I hope for swift resolve.

Maya Mara

Once again as Rox said....

AND


HERE is a mighty good question, IF we as a court are prepared to ensure that all participating member guilds of the court UNGUILD members who do not respect the two members per guild per meet rule, AND are prepared to impose bans on GUILDS who do not actively enforce this expectation,
WHAT are we as the Brethren Court going to do with guilds found to be in VIOLATION of Disney TOS?

Whilst having more than two members per guild is indeed a violation of Brethren Court rules violations of DISNEY rules far exceed our self imposed etiquette based rules.

Just a concern that concerns all,

Maya

VoIP Clarification
 

Pardon me for interrupting but I don't think everyone understands what Eva and JDAnne have stated from their calls to Disney Support.

Disney does not have a policy against USING VoIP programs such as TeamSpeak, XFire, or Ventrillo.

Disney does, however, have a policy against TALKING about above programs (with the POTCO chat medium) in regards to sharing usernames, server info, etc.

Again, Disney does not have a problem with players using it. They cannot control your use of it nor can they track it. They do have a problem with players chatting in their game about it when the discussion could lead to exposing another player's personal information and possibly creating a liability for Disney themselves.

Thank you, and the thread is all yours again.

* Not a Representative of Disney; Your Mileage May Vary

Thank you Mr. Niscadae. That is exactly what I wanted to hear. Many guilds have this sort of communication. Some require it to join. I have never used them, mainly because the few members that pop in once in a while play in different time zones. So I see no point to it. I trust my skills enough to be able to handle both typing and sailing. I think as the saying says "Smoke'em if you have'em." If there is nothing Disney can do about the issue. What can any of us do really? How can we track this? I sense that this issue comes back to guilds not liking/trusting each other. Because honestly if I could have more members at the same time I would definitely get a program as those mentioned. I personally don't care about who uses them or who doesn't. I see both the good points and the bad points. If Disney is OK with it then I'm OK with it. Thus The Court should be OK with it.

To clarify one other item. Just saying Team Speak, XFire, Ventrilo, or even YIM, AIM, or Google chat in game chat CAN get you a suspension of 1 to 3 days. It all depends on if a Disney chat reviewer a) sees it, and b) is in a bad mood.

I know one person who got 3 day suspension for just saying Ventrilo, and I personally got a 3 day once for trying to help someone get Vent working, by telling them to go to YIM to talk to me. I didn't give out personal info, I just told them to go to Yahoo Instant Messenger. The nice little message I got from Disney when they told me I was suspended included a single line of chat, the one telling someone to go to YIM so I could talk to them.

I will point out ONCE AGAIN, this information IS passed on in game, when we started playing POTC 99% of us were strangers. THIS INFO is passed on IN GAME, as it is our mode off meeting each other and our initial method if communication is held here. The amount of users of other chat prgs and voice prgs is at the lvl it is BECAUSE people slipped around the censors that are in place to protect OUR security and that of OUR children. I appreciate that you may feel that you would never abuse the knowledge of the gained personal information of another pirate BUT you cannot vouch for all users of your other place site or other chat/voice prg.

I say again, I WILL not be made to feel obliged to break DISNEY rules in order to keep up with the events on TBC, the violation has already been made and will continue to be made so long as we are complacent about this.

Maya

And I feel the need to bring about the common sense thought proccess versus the letter of the law approach:

WHY does Disney ban people for directing others to AIM, YIM, XFIRE, Teamspeak, Vent, etc?

BECAUSE those third party programs allow POTCO players to bypass Disney rules and language filters.

Also, based on naming conventions, it also seems to me it would be dependant upon who is reviewing files on any day. Some days one Disney employee will disapprove a name, but on a different day another employee will approve it. This goes even for names that are clearly NOT against the written rules.

Also, do realize that Disney doesn't ban for using a third party VOIP because they can't tell you are using a 3rd party VOIP unless you talk about it in game.

I believe you follow the rules the best if you understand the intent behind the rules. As for third party VOIP, the intent is for players NOT to use it. They don't ban for using it because they can't tell or prove. But just tell someone to get on Vent and WHOOOOSH! Yer gone.

Think about it.

And yes, I realize TBC's "official" view on this.

WOOO BART a resounding hear hear!

ok for those of you commenting on this thread that think it is ONLY about the use of other prgs for voice and chat that is the issue here, AS IF that isnt big enough on its own, I would like to remind you that this issue was raised because of an event that was held last tuesday and at the time was not a TBC event.

The motion put forward by TBC member Davy Burnrat seeking reassurance over the use of other prgs for voice and chat was prior to the event, at the time he like many thought it WAS a TBC event.
After some confusion the event took place and I summed up the event for a pof pirate who wasnt there at the time, nor were most of the administrators commenting on this thread there so far as I know:

'...In the cold hard light of the event, the organiser took the captains from their crews at short notice prior to the sail to give them rules, leaving little time for the information to be passed on before the event, they were not allowed to crew with their ship mates making communication without team spk/chat prg awkward.
-Some ships were shouting orders in privateer talk, which made it confusing and distracting looking for your teams orders. A major cause of lag is your chat log scrolling.
-Crews were talking in local which again a major cause of lag.
Captains had to whisper to crew if we were in close proximity to the opposite team, opening chat windows an clicking on pirate cards again a lag issue and a slow way to communicate.
-On top of all this we were restricted to playing within the islands and rocks area the WORST area for lag a lot of war sloops a lot of fury n fire in a small area making play with skill very difficult.
The result was those not using a chat programme or with excellent connection speeds an graphics cards, had crew dcing every few minutes or so, my captain ported when three of his four crew disconnected in the lag.

NOW I think my self all of this can be worked through BUT, the organiser wouldnt take my point as valid in stead he offered the words, 'After any great event there is always some one who shouts cheat'.
I felt belittled over seeking reassurance regarding non use of team spk or other chat prgs. I for one, and there are many like me, am not prepared to break disney rules on 3rd prty prgs and it simply isnt practical or fair to make us feel that we have to do it to be in with a chance of competeting.....'

Just giving you some perspective on the other issue attached to this thread and how it connects to the logistics of the event being proposed to become a TBC event.
Maya

So the issue here is more that you don't and won't use a voice chat program while playing so to be fair no one should. I do not really see how it is cheating the option to use them are available to anyone, it does not interfere directly with potco, and info for it can be exchanged here or on private guild sites not in game. From your post above if everyone had been using it the lag would have greatly reduced for everyone.

I certainly never said it was cheating and no, this was the original matter that brought up the issue, this was just to keep u fully informed for a full picture on the thread.

if u read my other posts my concerns on violations are most prominent, followed by my desire for information on who will be using the prgs in events so I can opt out.

Maya

Apparently no matter how it's written it will be interpreted however each of us see's fit. This debate could go on forever. If you feel it's an advantage maybe you should think about using the program yourself, it's free. Other than that I believe it's just personal choice. and yes your option is to opt out of the events.

Exactly JD. Each and everyone of us will have to trust the honor system. Because I can say, "ok , I won't use my voice program" then go ahead and use it. Reassurance is impossible to get. And we can't police our selves on this issue. It will fall on each of us that decision. All rules and laws are going to be interpreted to fit our agendas. It will happen until the end of all civilizations. You can hide from the storm or you can sail in it.

You miss my point entirely, though how from so many posts Im not sure, I WILL not be partaking of activity in violation of Disney terms of service, and I am not alone in this, I WILL not be sharing info with my team of how to connect via voice because to do so I would have to share the info in the game AFTER I get over the moral issue I have with using such a prg. NO matter which way you interpret the TOS a violation has to be made to aquire a voice prg for your crew.

NOW what I said was we should have a clear indication of who has them and who will be using them in competetive events for TBC, SO THAT I CAN OPT OUT if I can see no other way around being forced to accept them and having to compete with this violation AND disadvantage.

Maya

I think I know the real reason behind all this talk of saying using Voice Chat is ok. And here it is in a nut shell..

In the SVS team contest mentioned above you have more than one ship from a guild (and/or its alternate guilds) entered. But that ship may not be fully manned by that guild. In other words cannoneers from other guilds. The people on the two ships cannot be crewed under the same captain, so they can work together as a team against the other ships. Therefore they use the third party Voice Chat advantage over the other ships, telling their non-guild friends how to get on it. Most of them as stated above in this thread are regular cannoneers for that guild/captain (and/or it's alternate guilds) so they probably have been using it in normal svs if they are using it here in this contest.

Now if you use guild chat to give your commands, then the non-guild cannoneers will be left out. But if you used LOCAL chat, like I did you can communicate to your crew. HOWEVER you could not communicate to your other "friendly" ship to help you out, unless you used privateer or the illegal third party Voice chat or whispered.

This contest, to my understanding, was not about pitting a team of 2 to 3 ships working together against the others. It was about finding the BEST single team. Team meaning a crew of one captain and four gunners. My guild had two ships in the contest and we were on opposite sides. Which brings up another point... That in this type of contest, where you are looking for a "team of the month", it should be where the guilds (and/or its alternate guilds) should be assigned different sides, to be completely fair that is. But being honest here, some of these guilds who have a 2nd or 3rd guild for their alt pirates don't really want you to know they are affiliated with the main guild and may not be forthcoming with the information necessary to assign them the proper sides.

So basically you have to take what you're given and work with it or choose to not enter. The guilds that have been using Voice chat will continue to do so .... there is no way you can stop them. Just like in the game you will always find someone using a cheat or glitch. It is something that will always be in the game. And not just in the game but in life in general. You have people that circumvent rules on a daily basis. Is it frustrating... yes, it is. But here's the thing... if you all want the BC to grow and be respected you all need to take a hard stance on some of these issues. There are guilds out there waiting to see how the BC handles these types of problems before joining, mine included. What you all do and how you respond is being watched before decisions are made. And I'm not talking about you just saying your official stance is this but if you want to do it, go ahead type of response.

My guild will not use voice chat. We sink or sail with what Disney offers us to play with and our skills of course ... that said, see you on the water!!

The choice is your's to make, if you don't like it find another server or place to play, simply put.

As for guilds working together in the contest, the guilds were purposely split up and on opposite sides to keep this event a single ship team effort, along with being mixed guild teams.

The goal of the event is to have fun, and even though "winners" for the evening are announced , it still is an accumulative point system that adds up through each event in the season, again to make it fair as possible.

I say one last time, if you don't like or agree then simply opt out and do not participate

I had fun at the event. And never accused anyone of cheating. I am happy with the results of my team, and I have congratulated the winning ship. I look forward to being back. And .... I do not have any issues over our ships being put opposite each other. If you read my post I said that is the way it should be ... should be assigned different sides, to be completely fair that is. .

I am simply shedding light on the topic of the Voice chat and why some feel it was/is necessary to go against Disney rules to use it. And the reaction of the BC and its membership to this subject

Nope. This is not a third party program that allows you to talk while playing POTCO. It is a fan site. Disney has never stated that people who play POTCO can no longer post on message boards on the internet. Additionally, this forum does not allow the exchange of personal information or of email addresses, etc. All of this is in compliance with Disney's rules.

Based on that response, it is now my concern that maybe people really don't undertand what is meant by a third party program.

I know im not part of TBC, and my apologies if I am jumping in where I have no business, however I believe there are some major inaccuracies being stated in the VOIP debate.

There is something to be said about applying rules in the manners for which they were intended, and not bending the letter of them to apply in ways they were not intended.

The rule of 3rd party applications is a rule designed to encompass those that would use 3rd party applications to cheat. Applicatons that would change aspects of the game, edit gold, give weapons, grant special powers, grief other players, etc (ie cheats). Not because they can be used to circumvent communication rules in the game.

VOIP is not new, it was developed years ago, and has been in use by gamers for years. It has never been considered a cheat, merely a tool. Those competing that do not use it will definately be at a disadvantage to those that do.

The only rules applied towards such applications are the sharing of such contact information in the game itself. Giving emails, usernames, ip addresses, etc. Anything that leads to sharing of personal information IN THE GAME.
This is why noone has ever been banned for using one, not because Disney cannot tell they are using them as has been suggested, identifying known applications running in memory is very easily done if they had rules specifically against these applications. The rule is to cover those cheating applications that are not only designed to change the game, but to hide themselves from identification in the first place. I've gamed, and ladder matched for years, I know what cheating and the use of "3rd party applications" means in a games TOS.

People have even gone through steps to contact, and inquire with the games customer service/moderation staff and been told its alright, but theres still argument I guess over what Disney's lawyers meant, instead of how those that run the game interpret and apply the rule?

Stretching the term 3rd party applications as I have seen some apply it here could very easily be applied to POF as well in the aspect that Internet Explorer (or other browser) absolutely is without a doubt, a 3rd party application, and viewing/sharing information thru it via a 3rd party website would also be a violation of TOS. One could continue to stretch it and say you cant use your cell phone while playing because it is/uses 3rd party applications. Which btw VOIP is more reknowned these days for replacing our telephones, so applying the rules as stringently as has been suggested may disallow use of your telephone.

Now I think most think that idea is somewhat ridiculous, however if you apply the term 3rd party applications as loosely as a few have suggested, where does it end?

Zep, my phone is not attached to my internet and therefore not prg based, point is... the original point that is, this subject was thrown up by the use of chat/voice prgs in a competetive event, not all participants were aware of the advantage it gave some in that event. Further it brought up how this information IS PASSED ON IN GAME, and how that is a violation, it also brought up many interpretations of the TOS from mods, administrators and players alike. SOME with evidence that bans are imposed due to this particular violation. I know of one pirate whose account was terminated regarding xfire.
NOW what it boils down to IS when reading a thread such as this we need to take in all angles of the advantage/disadvantage, violation, moral and tactical issues regarding this subject AND stop bickering the 'presumed' meaning of the TOS.
When dealing with a section of the game as volatile as SVS can be, where pirates are overly keen to yell 'CHEAT' any time they are experiencing latency problems or any other benign oddity of which there are many in the game, we need to be clear on the every day common place opinions and componants of that game. BEING clear means we are being proactive in our gameplay so that we no longer need to feel we are 'fumbling around in the dark' harbouring resentful feelings or harassing/being harassed by others over A GAME.
Please visit the motions thread for further reading regarding this subject and the move to resolve last weeks UNRESOLVED question, so that I can, along with others concerned about these prgs, decide whether or not to participate in TBC events.

Maya

Maya please stop, aparently you have moved this argument to a point where it doesn't even concern the initial issue at hand. Where you are at now with your discussion has nothing to do with this competition or TBC

Btw the team that had the highest score last week was of mixed guild and no voip was used.

The out come of last weeks event was not part of the issue either, it was simply:

Reassure us that the events held under TBC will be fair FOR ALL.

The tangents that this, as any thread, has taken are actually very valid too and obviously people DO have comments to add here on the subject.

Clarification.

Maya

Yes the lag would have been much better if I had Team Speak and crew had team speak. My point is I am at a disadvantage for removing from controls of the ship to whisper. I could be wrong ....dont feel like checking .....but from what I recall the use of any software to gain an advantage over an opponant in POTCO is a violation of the rules. I personally dont care if TS is being used, I just ask that it not be used in the contest so everyone else that uses it will be on a level playing field. If the decision is to keep it then I need another means of communicating with my crew because what happend last week was a disaster. I also was unaware of a screen shot to be taken place to see who was in what place. All I no is they said in privateer chat the contest was over so I ported. Now I have no points for week 2. So, lets just start over hehe. Davy

************************************************** ********


JDanne, thats not a very constructable response to whats going on. Weather or not it is a violation I dont care, point is it is an advantage, this is a game, lets play with what disney gave us just one time....please, it is very difficult out there when you try to communicate with your team. I no I can go download this thing but I dont want to chance it. And again, it will likely do no good I no but if it is allowed we need to find another way for monitors to board the ship so we can crew our own crews and therefore communicate. I say lay these rules down and allow everyone a fair shot and start over. I have zero points because of the lack of communication on rules of the contest. I still had a blast and TY Phil for doing this. Lets just finalize the rules and start over and call that a trial run therefore I can have a chanceto get back in this thing. Davy

May I please remind all to abide by POF rules while posting. If you are not sure on those please read them there is a link to them in the main POF page.


Back to topic...

Your absolutely right the cell phone part was a stretch, but that in itself was the point. You should not blindly apply the phrase regarding 3rd party applications to include whatever is convenient, even contradicting facts received from the games administration. Do you realize when you make statements like "i know a pirate got in trouble for xfire" you implicate the application itself was the problem when more than likely the issue of passing their xfire information in the game was the issue, which is against the rules, a point everyone agrees on.

Make your groups decisions regarding passing of information in the game if you wish by all means, but Disney has this covered for you, why hassle it?

If you are debating over whether or not to allow VOIP use in TBC events, then I recommend everyone consider some facts (further contemplation on how to apply the 3rd party application is not facts, only opinions, mine included).

VOIP in itself does not warrant banning (per the games staff, since they are the governing body, going above them is unwarranted) (A member called and verified this).

VOIP can give an advantage over teams/players not using it. (However, if all are free to use it, its a choice. Should some peoples choices dictate others choices?)

VOIP has been used fairly in gaming for years and works well, it is not new technology, ive had it run behind my games with dialup!

Those that do not want to use it, will often try to keep everyone from using it. (This is a fact drawn not from here, but from 10 years of experience in online game competing, they dont want to use it, and since others using it is an advantage, they want it taken away)

Those that do use it, do not care if others choose to use it or not. (live and let live.. wonderful approach)

How will you police it?
How will you detect its use?
How can you fairly apply any rule prohibiting it if you have no control, or power to make a valid conclusion?

It just festers dissent in your court.
I recommend it be a use if you want approach.
If you feel you are at a disadvantage, then make use of it.
Most teams using it would probably be happy to make you a channel and share if they could.

It is not my intention to anger anyone, if I did so, my apologies. I have been around the block on this issue before however. To me, its water under the bridge. Seeing others struggle through it, I thought I would try to help.

May TBC prosper...

Ok I would first like to appoligize for not being at last weeks meeting as I am the rep of the Black Shark Inc. However I did participate in the SVS event.

"Any program that is used in pirates to gain an advantage of your opponant in any way is a violation of the rules." - I'd like for you folks who think its an advantage to please not how many times you sink us lol. Cause its a lot. A whole lot.

"I WILL not be made to feel obliged to break DISNEY rules in order to keep up with the events on TBC" - I'm pretty sure that pirates can't make pirates do anything.

"The motion put forward by TBC member Davy Burnrat seeking reassurance over the use of other prgs for voice and chat was prior to the event, at the time he like many thought it WAS a TBC event." - this issue was brought to the court by someone who isn't even a member>?

"-Crews were talking in local which again a major cause of lag. " - seriously chat causes lag?

I can't seem to understand why this is an issue. I don't have an issue with folks using. Cause from my position on the boat it isn't much of an advantage by far. If Roxy says its np then there is no use in kicking a dead horse. This can be debated for ever and never solved. This court is about having fun. Getting along. Setting a good example. Or at least that is how I understand it. I think what Phil did was great and again would like to invite those of you who think its an advantage to please take note on how much those that use it sink. Or come on board a ship. I'm sure you would be welcomed.
Looking forward to seeing you all wednesday.
WOOT WOOT
Kate Keelmorgan

Well maybe its time to speak up here...number one...i realize this is an open forum...and anyone can speak. Davy has brought this up, and he is not a member of the bretheren court...since his guild pretty much disolved he created his own....

Which he showed up at the court meeting as a member of his new guild which was not an approved guild. He then proceded to take the floor and and put this to the court?? How So??

Also if you check and watch us...(the Sharks) youll see that the vista clock glitch has been sinking us time after time....

P.S. So show me where having a voip helps you when the ships your shooting at isnt even where the computer says they are when they are clocked way ahead...

Yess ZEP it is your OPINION as all these posts are opinion... AGAIN PLS DO NOT MISUNDERSTAND THE POINT, I feel a few are being altogether tooo defensive here, probably because the lines on interpretation of the TOS are all too blurred

BUT to stress:

NO ONE IS TRYING TO GET ANYONE BANNED, that isnt about pirating either and all Im interested in is PIRATING.

A REMINDER:

And in Davey's own words:
Reassurance was requested that those choosing not to violate Disney TOS would not have to compete in TBC events where others were playing the voice/chat prg advantage.
The answer came back from TBC that whilst TBC would not condone the use of any method of violation of the DISNEY rules players are to use their own discretion as to whether they do use the prg which is the SUBJECT of he original question.
This offered no reasurance to those concerned, so the onus was put upon those who were in need of reassurance in the first place. Inform us if the prgs will be used and let all decide whether or not to participate in TBC events so that we do not have to feel obliged to make any kind of violation or compromise our own security to compete in them.

Maya

Davey had permission to talk at the event as granted by Roxanna, all attendees at the event are permitted to comment, non members cannot vote.
Since Davey motioned this point when he was still in a member guild and hopes that his own guild will be members also then your point is unfair and ungrounded.

TBC does not support the accusations from one guild to another of any form of cheating please be reminded of The Brethren Court Codex :
Article I, Section I, Paragraph I
All guilds participating in the Brethren Court agree to be respectful to ALL guilds and guild mates represented by the alliance. Harassment and accusations against other guilds will not be tolerated. We are all here to work together for the benefit of all pirates looking to make a difference.
AND ALSO
Article I, Section II, Paragraph I
Mates not respecting the Code will be subject to reprimand by their Guild Master, including Demotion, Suspension from the Guild or a BAN from the Guild depending on the severity of Disruption(s).

TBC

Maya Mara
Keeper of the Court

maya
i think its time you drop this asd you have been going at it with me over a year now.
now i have not nor has any member of my guild ever gave any info in game if we did we would not be in potco plane and simple.
my members hgave been gameing for years and have been using voip for over 4 years. so its time you got over it and move on thank you

umm sorry but the day the meeting was held Davy was no longer a member of the heros...and had created the one he was on when speaking...

also was asked by someone...will have to look who... said that new guilds should be established before approved...think you said that the person quoting me...

So that mean...that if i just show up and ask for the floor and roxanna says ok...that i can bring motions...even though im not in a member of the courts guild?

My apologies Eric if you have taken this personally, it was never intended to be such. The issue was one of reassurance in the interest of fair game play and an even playing field in TBC events only.

Maya

Ok then lets bring it to TBC events...as it has been brought into the court...by non court member guild about a private event held on tuesdays by another guild

Tobias I am reminding you to keep this from being personal.
The Brethren Court Chair and Founder Roxanna who is leads the court by example granted permission for Davey to speak and it was appropriately motioned PRIOR to the meeting on the TBC forum here on POF.

Roxanna has shown great temperance with TBC, I agree frustrations regarding this issue have gone way beyond my expectation, but please take confidence in that TBC is lead by some one who is fair to all equally.

Maya Mara
Keeper of the Court

This is not about fair I know Roxanna is fair...

Please...point me in the direction of the post prior to the meeting that it was established that Davy was going to have the floor...


All i see is a post by you...note i said YOU bringing up the topic of third party chat programs...

Tobias this is the motions before the court page.
http://www.piratesonlineforums.com/f...ad.php?t=12556

It may be useful for you to familiarise yourself with The Brethren Court forum.

The Pirata Codex of The Brethren Court.

http://www.piratesonlineforums.com/f...ad.php?t=12547

Maya Mara
Keeper of the Court

Nice links...but none of them point to anything saying DAVY a non brethren court guild would have the floor...

Thanks for proving my point


In case your really missing the point...you said it was established prior to the meeting that DAVY was to be having the floor at TBC meeting

Wow
People don't you think this is getting way out of hand and way too serious? This is just a game we are talking about here. Not life and death. Look as I stated before ... the guilds that use team speak will continue to do so.

Period.

There is no way you or Disney can stop them. Yes it would be nice if everyone was on the same playing field, but lets face it ... that is a dream and not reality. Not in games nor in real life. There are always the haves and have nots. Me personally I do not care whether they use it or not. I can sink them just as easily as non voice chatters. I only care about the game TOS rules and that all pirates play fair. Yes you cannot mention team speak, xfire or what ever Voice chat you are using in the game. The reason is to protect the kids on the game and your privacy. If you mention it or try to give that information to another player while in game you run the risk of being banned. So be forewarned on that.

If you choose to use it that is your personal choice. I will not ever use it. I think personally that it is an advantage over others. And this isn't just because I don't use it. I am thinking of those who can't use the program for issues of a personal nature like the financial cost, computer connections, hearing impaired or even people with speech handicaps. So since we all agree that people will use it can we just move on... the original issue was I believe the crewing problem in a svs contest.

Now I have a Solution ---

to the debate of the Tuesday crewing problem ....

1. Let the captains crew their crew...
2. Have the captains FRIEND the observers/judges so they can tp to the ships
3. Give the instructions to EVERYONE present..
4. Have an observer/judge for each side
5. Crew the Observers/judge together and they can relay info to EVERYONE via privateer chat

on point 3 I think it would be better to tell everyone the rules... I had 4 peeps whispering me wanting to know what was going on while the rules were given and ships assigned -- that made it extremely difficult for me to follow what was being said in crew, between the whispers and beach chatter the chat scrolled too fast. Now you will have people spamming the beach rule chat -- Solution -- if they speak before the rules are completely given out --- disqualify them from the competition. Also after the rules are delivered allow a question and answer period for clarification purposes.

simple eh?

AT last some one not caught up in the fear of the violation trap to offer a real solution to the event issue.
TY Dhestroyer and thankyou for keeping with the thread throughout.

Maya

hmmm so no comment on my pointing out what you said...aruguing against me...and the references you so readily supplied..

Also nothing against D but tuesdays svs event is not a Bretheren Courth Event...at least not yet...

Thank you for pointing that out Tobias, I did know that, but I also know that the crewing situation is what started this whole topic on use of voice chats vs those that didn't have it and The Bretheren Courts' stance on the issue for its events. ... I am just offering a level headed solution to an escalating issue. I not a member of the BC... at least not yet ... I am really put off by all the drama and bickering going on within the BC when its purpose is suppose to be bringing people together. Perhaps if everyone would take a breath, step back and learn to bend a bit the BC may have a chance to make it.

Hey D...like i said..nothing against your post...it was well thought out...and well prepared...

I do appreciate that...

I did already answer this:

The Motions page: http://www.piratesonlineforums.com/f...ad.php?t=12556

Might I also remind you that Roxanna, Commodore Zeke - Speaker of the Court, Ordo Skirata - Keeper of the Court and myself as a Keeper of the Court were all in attendance administrating proceedings along with a number of court referees, all those that took the floor were permitted to do so by the Chairmen Roxanna. And as mentioned previously the correct proceedure was followed. And the floor opened for discussion on the point.

This repeated asking me to clarify how Davey Burnrat was permitted to bring his point to TBC meeting is unecessary as I did answer you initially on the subject.
Should you have any further concerns I suggest you motion them on here or approach the subject with the other administrators in attendance and Roxanna herself.


Maya Mara
Keeper of the Court

Thanks maya a link that dont work...Error 404 and if youll check the records Davy applied to be a member of the court with his new guild sunday at 440 something on Sunday August 9th

Not prior to the meeting in which he was allowed to speak...

So keep quoting...facts that dont exist....

All guilds members or not are allowed to participate in the events and meetings. If they asked for the floor and if this is granted then they can bring their concerns/issues to the meetings. However their vote on things is not taken into consideration. Just like this sub-forum and its threads everyone is welcomed to participate. In fact, I want to think that it is encouraged. At least I do. I am happy to see all of the points and views in this particular topic. Thanks to this I have a more informed view on this issue. With that said, I still believe that it is the choice of each and everyone here to use or not use such programs at whatever risk that might exist. Just like its a choice to participate or not in events that might involve their use. That is my particular view.

The Courts views on this topic can be viewed in other threads of this sub-forum. Even though Maya's link doesn't work, the thread is there for everyone to see. Thanks for all the views on this matter.

I would like to invite anyone who thinks that using a voice chat gives an unfair advantage to board a ship with a crew using it and see how much of an advantage it truely gives. I know from experience that the boats that I'm on with all of us using it get sunk all the time and very frequently.

Okay mates, I just got off the phone with a Disney rep. Guess what.

Yep. HE stated that use of ANY third party program--to include VOIP programs like X-Fire, Teamspeak, or Ventrilo--was a violation of the TOS and would result in a ban if discovered. He stated that they "discover" the use of VOIP in-game when people pass VOIP info to each other in-game.

He also stated the reason VOIP isn't permitted is because it allows users to bypass the disney chat filters they have put in place AND upgraded recently.

Now, as I stated before, there is a reason behind the rule. It doesn't matter how long VOIP has been around. It doesn't matter how long others have used it or in what other games. The rep I talked to very specifically said that in Disney's POTCO there is NO allowed 3rd party programs used in game that allow people to bypass the chat filters.

So, perhaps I was correct when I wrote earlier that it depends on who is being asked on any particular day? I would caution SAFETY over CONVENIENCE.

Can someone please post what happened last meeting please I was out of town and I want to know what happened, including why was Maya removed from her position and why I wasn't asked my input in that matter.

My apologies for not replying earlier me buckos.

I have been super busy these passed few days but realize several folks were missing from last weeks meeting.

I will be posting a post meeting summary shortly as well as to the reasons why Maya was removed from Steering Committee. It was a decision that was made after careful consideration, and will be addressed in my summary.

Thanks mateys!
Roxy

:SkullBullet1:

Post Meeting Disscusion - Last Weeks Meeting Summary
 

Ahoy for those mates that may have missed last weeks meeting:

Here be a quick summary of last week's meeting and event...

Meeting was called to order; Attendance was taken.

Announcements:
The court was created to run events, not have politics amongst guilds and individuals. Therefore some changes to the way meetings are held are coming.

New Guild Membership will be slower in inducting new guilds into TBC.
The growth of the court during the 2 month time frame has been rather rapid and the initial foundations of trust amongst participating guilds did not set properly before we started building the house.

Circle of Trust needs to be established among the guilds currently involved before brining on new guilds, however, new guilds are still encouraged to participate to show their willingness to help out and also help gain the trust of the other guilds of TBC.
Also, New Guilds wanting membership should have an existing TBC member sponsor their guild for membership. This will help mates own up to their word that they will bring respectable guilds into the court, and make them more cautious of who the sponsor.

Concerning offenses against The Code:
For those that have been with this from the beginning it is essential to honor and uphold the code at all times, be it TBC event gathering or not. Many guilds are in agreement that a "one chance" rule be initiated to show the seriousness of The Code. Trust is essential for our Court to function. Trust can be established through doing joint ventures IN GAME and through discussion on the Forums. Slanderous or skewering remarks do not become a member of TBC, especially it's senior leadership. Any pirate with TBC membership found violating Disney TOS and TBC Code, with proof of said violation, will be suspended from their position in the court and possibly even from TBC. NO GREY AREA here folks. It is the duty and responsibility of the senior leadership of TBC to set an example for all participating guilds of fair play and respectful gaming. It is the duty of EVERY GM and SENIOR OFFICER of each guild participating in TBC to filter the Code we've set forth as a community, down to the lowest bilge rat on yer ship, so that every mate is informed.
(The decision to suspend any member of the Steering Committee inevitably falls on the table of TBC Chairmen, and it was a choice weighed with the utmost seriousness and not voted on before the court)

(Any evidence presented of a TBC member violating The Code, be it eye witness account or screen shot, will be taken into account by TBC Chairmen and Steering Committee Members for a ruling of action)

(Any evidence presented of a TBC Steering Committee member violating The Code, be it eye witness account or screen shot, will be taken into account by TBC Chairmen for a ruling of action)

Also,
We have the support of many pirates around the Caribbean who are pulling for us and applauding our accomplishments.
Going into the 2nd month anniversary it is my hopes that we can spread the spirit of brethrenhood and team work for the dark winds soon to be blowing into our island homeland.
This upcoming War will be further addressed at the 2nd Anniversary Meeting, Wed, 08/19/09

Sorry if i missed anything mates!

:SkullBullet1:

Concerning the third party chat programs,
I think they should not be used because of many reasons,
1. Unfair advantage over others. It's much harder for people who can not talk in real time to each other and must take their hands off the controls to type.
2. Filter. Disney has a chat filter but voice programs do not. You can say anything you want in one of those and there are people who are not adults like me that play this game.
3. I know someone went over these already but I am trying to accentuate the point.

Please do not use third party chat programs it makes it harder for others.

Post Meeting Discussion
 

Meeting Notes from Wednesday October 28, 2009

Guilds in Attendance:
Pyscho Sea Mob
The Thieves Den
The Savvy
Clan Storm
Black Shark Inc.
For the Fun of It
Beyond Levels

Announcements:
Port Royal Defense Force Co - Op with The League of Guilds
Constance Sorrow, Captain Cromwell - whisper to him "John Moses" if ye spot him, ye may receive a reward, Old Sooty - keep an eye out for this ghost, post your encounters with any of the three ye may have for others to share in the experience.

Motions Before the Court:

-Propose Steering Committee Update: Break into [3] Branches: Events, Membership and Publishing/Public Relations
[MOTION PASSED]

-Propose Change in Meeting Day/Time
[MOTION PASSED] - Wednesday @ 8:30 pm Central is the new proposed Meeting Day/Time

-Propose Change in Event Day/Time
[MOTION PASSED] - Still need to select a Day and Time to hold weekly Events

-Propose Event Calendar
[MOTION PASSED] - Inquire if POF has an event calendar

-Propose a Co-Op RDF with The League of Guilds regarding the Defense of Port Royal.
[MOTION PASSED] - During an Invasion, a Co - Op will be available to those guilds wishing to participate

-Guild found in Violation(s) of The Code.
-Propose a 1 MONTH BAN from TBC functions IN GAME.
-Counter-proposal of a Permanent Ban from TBC functions IN GAME.
-Propose that Guild Members in Said Guild be removed from The Steering Committee
[MOTION FAILED] - Guild found in Violation will not be Banned.

-Proposition to invoke Article 5 of the code the right of parlay on behalf of the Guild found in Violation(s) of the Code.
[MOTION PASSED]

-Propose adding Articles of TBC Sovereignty to The Code
*Proposition has been seconded
[MOTION PASSED]

News:
TBC has been approached by two other guild alliances seeking a merge. It was discussed that we should get to know these guilds before a merge or co op venture be conceived.

Roxy Redcrow
GM Clan Storm

:SkullBullet1:

POF has an event calendar.

Post Meeting Disscusion - Last Weeks Meeting Summary
 

Meeting Notes from Wednesday November 11th, 2009

Guilds in Attendance:
Crimson Squad
Clan Storm
On the Loose
Thieves Den
For the Fun of It
O'Fury's Court
Black Shark Inc.
The Savvy
Pyscho Sea Mob

Announcements:
-Captain Cromwell - Be on the look out for this ghostly pirate. Mention the name "John Moses" to him and ye could be in for a reward.
[Note] There be a special code Cromwell be giving in order to receive your reward, stay keen to what ye be given.

-Steering Committee Volunteers : Now that The Steering Committee is to be separated into [3] Branches, we will need 3 Volunteers to head up each branch.
Sign Up for Steering Committee, it can be any guild mate willing to take up the torch. Event Committee needs a chairmen, Membership Committee needs a chairmen and Public Relations & Publishing Committee needs a chairmen.

-Keeping your guild mates informed! TBC is to the benefit of the guilds involved, not just the GMs and Officers that conduct the meetings. Please make the effort to trickle down the information and topics discussed here and at the forums and encourage your guild mates to become involved!

-Event Calendar: We now have an active event calendar. Click on the "Calendar" Link on the top of the page for an easy and quick way to stay informed to TBC activities & events.

-The Code: Article VI - The Articles of Sovereignty have been added to The Code. Please inform your GM / Officers / Guildmates of the updates.

-The Caribbean Poker All Stars Tournament - November: Tuesday Nov. 10th kicked off the beginning of the November Tournament. Players are invited to join in the next round of the match taking place Tuesday Nov. 24th. Check the Calendar for Time, Location, Server and Rules for the Tournament. Spread the word to your Guild Mates. Also check out "The Caribbean Poker All Stars Tournament Results" to keep track of you and your competition's chip stack.

Membership:
Guilds up for a Vote:
Crimson Squad - Vote Yay - New Brethren Court Member! :degen:
For the Fun of It - Vote Yay - New Brethren Court Member! :degen:

Probation Period Updates for New Applicants:
McRaging [4] Weeks Remaining
Oceanus’ Few [4] Weeks Remaining
Ragoonz [4] Weeks Remaining
Divine Legion [4] Weeks Remaining

Motions Before the Court:

-Propose Change in Event Day/Time - Proposed Days - Friday Nights, Saturday Nights or Afternoons, Sunday Afternoons or Early Evenings. Final Vote will take place at next week's meeting to determine a set day and time for the Events to take place on a weekly basis.

Open Floor Discussion:
-New Guilds in attendance asked questions concerning court functions and membership eligibility, etc etc. All information may be obtained by viewing "The Code" and "What is The Brethren Court?" threads in the main TBC forum.

News Update:
UPDATE:
The representative from "The Brethren of Guilds" has informed me that the organization has disbanded and that some guilds may seek membership with TBC.
We welcome new guilds with open arms and are happy to have more pirates taking up the flag of pirate community participation.

-Conclude Meeting

End Notes]<<<<<

:SkullBullet1: